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Post by Immanuel on Nov 5, 2017 12:29:57 GMT
Eysua (Jesus) and his sayings Eysua is perceived to have said this: 7:1 "Stop judging, that you may not be judged.
2 For as you judge, so will you be judged, and the measure with which you measure will be measured out to you.
3 Why do you notice the splinter in your brother's eye, but do not perceive the wooden beam in your own eye?
4 How can you say to your brother, 'Let me remove that splinter from your eye,' while the wooden beam is in your eye?
5 You hypocrite, remove the wooden beam from your eye first; then you will see clearly to remove the splinter from your brother's eye.What he actually says is this: 7:1 "Stop condemning, that you may not be condemned 2 For as you condemn, so will you be condemned, and the method with which you [use as] method will be [the] method out to you. 3 Why do you notice the splinter in your brother's eye, but do not perceive the wooden beam in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, 'Let me remove that splinter from your eye,' while the wooden beam is in your eye? 5 You hypocrite, remove the wooden beam from your eye first; then you will see clearly to remove the splinter from your brother's eye. He does not say you cannot judge, but he says that you should first see straight before you attempt to do so. He says that you can "remove the splinter from the brother's eye" when you have removed the wooden beam from your own eye. In essence he says you should not condemn others as faulty before you can see the solution for yourself. This is related to the other thread in which I write about "The conceptual pillars of developmental living". If you can merely complain about the "splinter in your brother's eye" without knowing how you can remove it because you yourself cannot target it. Just complaining of how bad someone is without being able to offer a remedy is counterproductive and as Eysua says you must "remove the wooden beam from your own eye first". Conclusion is, Eysua does not say you should not judge, he is saying that you cannot just condemn without being able to offer a solution or even seeing your own faults. When you condemn others all around you, you condemn yourself. Only when you can offer people a solution or help them, then you should do so. A person with his own faults cannot help another faulty person, so deal with yourself first. BUT, Eysua says nothing of that you can form your own opinion about someone, but it must be based on sound judgment and so if you cannot offer something which will help them then you merely condemn them for their being. This is highly related to what I wrote in the other thread about the Lifestyle of someone who is Being where everything must be based on judgment, whenever you are mentally able to judge and not prematurely and when you deal with judgment and act out on someone it should be when you can offer them a remedy OR OTHERWISE IT IS MERE CONDEMNATION. You can derive multiple good lessons from these few words that Eysua uttered. He also says that you cannot make the splinter from your brother's eye disappear unless yours is removed as well. For example, if you are a parent to a child and you as a parent watch violent movies, you cannot expect your child to abstain from violent movies because they do what you do. Then you cannot condemn their behavior because it is what you do yourself. You cannot expect a child not to dominate their friends if you yourself have a tendency to dominate others around you, it is just hypocritical to condemn them and you ought to deal with yourself first. The children will not listen to you, for they see what you do and no matter if they outright tell you or not, this is what they will think and do themselves. The human being is an imitating being, if you want people to change you have to change yourself first. Only through acting like a beacon of light, others will do the same and you must lead people into learning that you should listen to the mind and its judgment through superior mental processes and not what the bodily tells with its lowly instinctive driving. You have to conceive the minds of people for them to think and use that faculty and then they can stand on their own legs. Unless you do so yourself, you cannot expect others will do, and condemnation is just backwards thinking on a very low level of beastly behavior. You must help others to think the right way, you cannot just expect people to use their reason for there are so many traps in this world and do not condemn, seek a remedy to help them, evolve into becoming empathetic because you understand reality. So this is also why Eysua says you should also care for your enemy, an enemy is a person who is not friendly towards you because they condemn you and if you condemn them in return they will simply continue to condemn you. You must find shrewd ways of changing their thinking, because " fighting fire with fire" does not help, it will only ignite more material to burn. When something burns you throw water on it, that is logical, but when a human is on fire within you do not use water, why? This is because you do not use your mind but you respond with the bodily ignition that happens inside you, because you do not expect people to become angry and so you become angry yourself. Try not becoming angry the next time someone becomes angry and meet their heat with chilling effects. It will be difficult because your mind is weak to the bodily, but if you practice this each time you enter a situation where your mood may be affected, then you become stronger mentally to control the situation. This is when you STRENGTHEN THE BEING, the definition of Being is total absoluteness ("B'esm allah... Al-Rahman Al-Raheem" in ancient Arabic) and what that is you can figure out for yourself, I trust you on that, if you use your judgement. Just ask yourself what is not being complete as a Being. Yes, it is when you have weaknesses/defects/flaws. In order to deal with what makes you defect you must judge what are your defects and then do something about it and this is when your faith you can do it comes in. If you accept yourself to not have the capability to become completer, then so you shall remain because you accept your faults, but if you have faith you can improve so you can also improve yourself into a better completion. It takes a strong faith in order to believe you can be an absolutely complete Being, but it is possible, although it takes learning about development and most importantly what drives you not to be absolute. What causes you as a Being not to be complete? What "colors" your Being? Yes, the answer is simple, the body in which you feel you are belonging to does cause you to be who you think you are, it has an autonomous driving which affects you constantly when you are not strong enough to resist it. Do you necessarily have to be like this body? No, you can be whoever you like, even superhuman, your faith puts the limitation and it is more about realizing yourself. The puzzle/challenge and the delusion of this Earth and its features is that you may identify yourself with your bodily, but actually your mind and the accompanying evolving (or devolving depending on how you fare) consciousness is a distinctly separate entity from the body and you can completely ignore the bodily affection if you like and have a sufficiently strong Being, i.e. you do not necessarily have to fare as according to its driving, you can stand above the bodily if you so have the intention and for this is required to have the faith/confidence that it is possible. This is why I urge people who come to this forum to actually test the way of living taught by it, for the mental ascension that occurs to you by "rebelling" against the bodily desires is such an experience that you will literally feel the difference between your consciousness and the body and the body feels just like some extension of your self, the identification with the body vanishes and you can perceive the distinction between the two phenomena. When you stimulate the Being of you, then this is understood as virtually equal to your consciousness, your sense of Being. Your consciousness is more or less the same as your mind and your mental level is determined by your state of Being. Do not think of spirits, souls and the kind of things as taught by religious doctrines, but focus on the energy strength of the Being of yours, your hard focusing "to be", focus on BEING, the mere determination "to be Being" is reinforcing it and you must practice what it means to be and what makes you unique. Most importantly it is to stimulate your ability to be in control, this is essential in Being independently, you cannot allow yourself to lose control but must consciously always strive to assume control if you somehow lost it. That you have bodily cravings and act accordingly is not okay, it is not an excuse, if you know better. There is no reason to be condemned for "sinning", but do not allow yourself, for your own good. The body is essentially an animal, a kind of primate, and your mind is its master. The animal should not be the mind's master but the opposite should be the truth. You are deluded by the "plot" of this universe that you have an identity with this body you call yours and in fact you originate from something you would consider "supernatural", your mind IS supernatural, it can stand above nature and because this is empirically testable it is possible to prove the mind is supernatural and that is one of the missions of this forum's project. Supernatural as a definition does not merely mean you can do physical manipulation of matter, but your psychology and that you can behave abnormally in contrast to the bodily driving is proving the supernatural nature of your mind even if you cannot do physical manipulation a'la Star Wars, for example. I will continue with another saying of Eysua later. Be well Qarael Amenuel
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Post by Immanuel on Nov 6, 2017 20:31:25 GMT
To follow up linguistically on the previous post about judge. This is to judge according to English (from Longman Dictionary of Contemporary English):
judge 2 S3 W3 verb ( past tense and past participle judged , present participle judging )
1 opinion [ intransitive and transitive ] to form or give an opinion about someone or something after thinking carefully about all the information you know about them : You should never judge a person by their looks. Judge us on the improvements we make in the economy. The therapist judged that Margaret had made a serious attempt to kill herself. pollutants that were judged hazardous to human health I am in no position to judge whether what she is doing is right or wrong. The economic results of the reforms are very difficult to judge . The likelihood of future bombs was impossible to judge . We judge the success of a product by the number of sales it brings in. His conduct, judged objectively by what he has done, is dishonest. Robert wanted to go and help him, but judged it best to stay where he was. Do not judge her too harshly , as she was very young at the time. 2 judging by/from something used to say that you are making a guess based on what you have just seen, heard, or learned : Judging by his jovial manner, he must have enjoyed his meal. Judging from what you say in your letter, you don’t sound well. 3 competition [ intransitive and transitive ] to decide on the result of a competition : I had the difficult task of judging the competition. judge somebody on something Competitors will be judged on speed and accuracy. 4 criticize [ intransitive and transitive ] to form an opinion about someone, especially in an unfair or criticizing way : He just accepts people for what they are and he doesn’t judge them. 5 law [ transitive ] to decide whether someone is guilty of a crime in court 6 it’s not for somebody to judge used to say that you do not think someone has the right to give their opinion about something : Was it the right decision? It’s not for us to judge. 7 as far as I can judge used to say that you think what you are saying is true, but you are not sure 8 don’t judge a book by its cover used to say that you should not form an opinion based only on the way something looks
Compare judge with condemn
con‧demn / kəndem / verb [ transitive ]
1 disapprove to say very strongly that you do not approve of something or someone, especially because you think it is morally wrong :
Politicians were quick to condemn the bombing.
condemn something/somebody as something
The law has been condemned as an attack on personal liberty.
condemn somebody/something for (doing) something
She knew that society would condemn her for leaving her children.
2 punish to give someone a severe punishment after deciding they are guilty of a crime
condemn somebody to something
He was found guilty and condemned to death .
3 force to do something if a particular situation condemns someone to something, it forces them to live in an unpleasant way or to do something unpleasant
condemn somebody to (do) something
people condemned to a life of poverty
His occupation condemned him to spend long periods of time away from his family.
4 not safe to state officially that something is not safe enough to be used :
an old house that had been condemned
condemn something as something
The pool was closed after being condemned as a health hazard.
What does the passage with Eysua's utterance say?
2 For as you condemn, so will you be condemned, and the proportion with which you [use as] proportion will be [the] proportion out to you.
[Note I changed method with proportion instead]
OR
2 For as you judge, so will you be judged, and the measure with which you measure
will be measured out to you.
Use your logic. What do you really think Eysua says if you are reasonable?
Yes, Eysua is speaking about to "disapprove to say very strongly that you do not approve of something or someone, especially because you think it is morally wrong"
That is condemnation and it is what Eysua is referring to in his statement from the past.
People have, due to their emotions, the opinion one should not judge people, but judging is just fine and it is about what you do with what you think of others, the judgment of another is merely forming an opinion about them. If you judge people properly, you may be able to see what kind of remedy they require, but you should avoid letting it fall into mere condemnation for it is condemnation to curse, punish or whatever it is you seek to do.
What Eysua is speaking about is someone who in a derogatory/demeaning way criticize people around them, condemn or curse, without realizing their own faults and who do not seek to come up with a solution. It is actually quite clear from the context with the available text we have to deduct logically Eysua is speaking about cursing, punishing and/or condemning people around oneself and that without looking at what they themselves do and condemnation of others is showing a lack in oneself, for the wise and developed person seeks a solution to problems, not just complaining about others, showing strong disapproval of them and treating them badly and in demeaning ways. Take my similitude about a parent and a child in the previous post for example, a parent may yell at their child not to do something while they themselves exhibit this disapproved behavior and so this parent is hypocritical. The child is innocent and the parent is literally stupid, but it is more about being backwards and not having a sufficiently deep consciousness and one who does not reflect nor do something about themselves first. Like Michael Jackson conveyed in a song; "better start with the man in the mirror" even if Mr. Jackson should have done something about himself, he said something very true and that is "better take a good look at yourself, the man (or woman) in the mirror".
It is VERY GOOD to criticize yourself. Criticize yourself, but do it do become better and not to belittle yourself.
Do not accept yourself for who you are... but not because you are bad, but because you can become better.
Who you are right now is only right now, you can take yourself wherever you like, it is you yourself who set up the limitations and excuses that you are good as you are is simply a foolish man's (or woman's) vision. Do not look upon someone like Eysua, or perhaps me, or Abrahem, or Muse, and say you cannot be like that, this is just setting a low standard for yourself and fundamentally each one of us have EXACTLY the same potential, only that those of us who are on top did not accept a low standard for ourselves and we embraced development, and we are not good because we are physically strong, full of muscles or even professors of some human science, but because we have evolved our minds and enabled a higher level of thinking. This higher level of thinking is only realizable (fathomable) whenever you reach there, but if you put your mind to it where it is right now you will realize it is only logical and if you read all which is propagated on this forum about mental growth you can surely come to your senses about it.
The forum does not "preach" a lot of rambling words and you should surely test it for yourself and see the difference but you must start with using a strong willpower at claiming your Being, assuming control over your self and steering it consciously forward and increase the determination that you bring it forward through consciousness and exercise the mind. When you have this strong determination and keep going forward (Arabic/Semitic lang. "A'qum Al-Salawteh") you will come to your senses as a direct consequence as your mind is unclouded and it will indirectly cause you to understand more along the journey. It is just about taking those first steps and have faith in it and continue all the way. As I have said to some "students" of mine, to continue taking one step at a time progressively up the long stairway, if imagining it leading up to the traditional projection of "Heaven". It may be easier and less discouraging to not look all the way up the top but look at the few steps just ahead. But you should never ever look backwards and down the stairway or you may stagger. However, sometimes when you seem to be unable to get a foothold on the next step, for some reason, it may be better to take a big leap upwards... the parable in that is that if you are prevented from stopping a bad habit in your life it may be best to jump it over completely as if you had taken several steps at once. Something similar we shall delve into when I go unto another saying of Eysua to explain it, the misconceived saying where it sounds as if Eysua tells people to cut off limbs or tear out eyes, a completely illogical and drastic measure.
Be well Qarael Amenuel
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Post by rekkd on Nov 7, 2017 3:34:20 GMT
Great writings Immanuel! Very informative and motivational. I really would love to change and have total control over my body. I’m sick of meaningless desires that seem so important yet still meaningless. I’m sick of being a slave to my body and this world!! This has to change.
I will not make excuses for myself anymore, I will be in full control.
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Post by Immanuel on Nov 11, 2017 17:53:26 GMT
Let me continue with another of Eysua's sayings. This segment of text may likely be part of one and the same saying.
Matthew: 5:27 "You have heard that it was said, 'You shall not commit adultery.' 28 But I say to you, everyone who looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one of your members than to have your whole body thrown into Gehenna. 30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one of your members than to have your whole body go into Gehenna. 31 "It was also said, 'Whoever divorces his wife must give her a bill of divorce.' 32 But I say to you, whoever divorces his wife (unless the marriage is unlawful) causes her to commit adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
So what does Eysua mean here? Is he saying that you should literally cut off your hand or tear out your eye? Or is there a problem with the translation?
Let us first take a greater look at the chapter. See how it will seem if we segment all surrounding utterances of the chapter:
21 "You have heard that it was said to your ancestors, 'You shall not kill; and whoever kills will be liable to judgment.' 22 But I say to you, whoever is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment, and whoever says to his brother, 'Raqa,' will be answerable to the Sanhedrin, and whoever says, 'You fool,' will be liable to fiery Gehenna. 23 Therefore, if you bring your gift to the altar, and there recall that your brother has anything against you, 24 leave your gift there at the altar, go first and be reconciled with your brother, and then come and offer your gift. 25 Settle with your opponent quickly while on the way to court with him. Otherwise your opponent will hand you over to the judge, and the judge will hand you over to the guard, and you will be thrown into prison. 26 Amen, I say to you, you will not be released until you have paid the last penny.
27 "You have heard that it was said, 'You shall not commit adultery.'
28 But I say to you, everyone who looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
29 If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one of your members than to have your whole body thrown into Gehenna.
30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one of your members than to have your whole body go into Gehenna.
31 "It was also said, 'Whoever divorces his wife must give her a bill of divorce.'
32 But I say to you, whoever divorces his wife (unless the marriage is unlawful) causes her to commit adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
33 "Again you have heard that it was said to your ancestors, 'Do not take a false oath, but make good to the Lord all that you vow.'
34 But I say to you, do not swear at all; not by heaven, for it is God's throne;
35 nor by the earth, for it is his footstool; nor by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great King.
36 Do not swear by your head, for you cannot make a single hair white or black.
37 Let your 'Yes' mean 'Yes,' and your 'No' mean 'No.' Anything more is from the evil one.
38 "You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.'
39 But I say to you, offer no resistance to one who is evil. When someone strikes you on (your) right cheek, turn the other one to him as well.
40 If anyone wants to go to law with you over your tunic, hand him your cloak as well.
41 Should anyone press you into service for one mile, go with him for two miles.
42 Give to the one who asks of you, and do not turn your back on one who wants to borrow.
43 "You have heard that it was said, 'You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.'
44 But I say to you, love your enemies, and pray for those who persecute you,
45 that you may be children of your heavenly Father, for he makes his sun rise on the bad and the good, and causes rain to fall on the just and the unjust.
46 For if you love those who love you, what recompense will you have? Do not the tax collectors do the same?
47 And if you greet your brothers only, what is unusual about that? Do not the pagans do the same?
48 So be perfect, just as your heavenly Father is perfect.
Logic tells that every time Eysua utters "You have heard that it was said", it is obvious he starts on a new paragraph, a new topic within his own teaching.
Now back to the part of the saying I was going to discuss within this post. Here it is:
29 If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one of your members than to have your whole body thrown into Gehenna.
30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one of your members than to have your whole body go into Gehenna.
Logic tells Eysua must be reasonable enough not to mean you are to actually cut off your hand or tear your eyeball out, that would seem too extreme and incapacitating to be really wise and there are better solutions to the problem for whenever your hands or eyes cause you to sin, which Eysua also probably means here but the translation is off.
Worth knowing is that in the Semitic languages including Arabic, the words of those languages are descriptive in their origin and, so to say, "painting" in what they like to say, and so the same word which is used for hand can also mean "what you do with your hand, e.g. like you say in English when you say "hand me that item, will you please? and so Eysua may never have said that a person should cut the hand off but actually stop the doing which causes you to sin. It is noteworthy that Eysua also mentions both the right eye and the right hand, so it is not even certain that right is meaning right. Either way, what does Eysua say then?
This is a root claimed to mean right in Semitic languages.
Ya-Miim-Nun = right side, right, right hand, oath, bless, lead to the right, be a cause of blessing, prosperous/fortunate/lucky.
It is harder to confirm what the next word is supposed to be, but commonly this root may occur and in my project on Quran, it is often this word which is mistranslated as hand when it is not literally a hand which it talked about:
Ya-Dal-Ya = to touch, aid, do good, be beneficent, show power and superiority, a hand. By his agency/means.
With a willing hand, out of hand, having financial ability.
In acknowledgement of the superior power, in ready money and not in the form of deferred payment, considering it as a favour, on account of help, (payment should be made by the hand of the parties themselves without the intervention of a third party and without reluctance.
baina yadaihi - before him, in his presence hit, between his two hands.
ulill aidi - men of power (lit. gifted with hands)
suqaita fi aidihim (idiomatic expression) they repented, the idea seems to be that they hit their fingers in grief and contrition.
Handy, Might, Power, Superiority, Benefit, Possession, Favour, Generosity. The idea behind those expressions is that the use of the hand is the real source of the superiority and power. Under his authority, upper hand, arm, foreleg of a beast, handle of a tool, wing of a bird.
ma qaddamat yada - that is what thou hast deserved.
Basically, it is strange that such a word like this is often translated hand when its main connotation is whatever you are doing with your hands.
This is the word for eye in the Semitic root system:
Ayn-Ya-Nun = to hurt in the eye, smite anyone with the evil eye, flow tears, become a spy. Aayan - to view, face. 'Ainun - eye, look, hole, but of a tree, spy, middle letter of a trilateral word, spring of water, chief, personage of a place. A'yan (pl. 'Inun): lovely, wide-eyed, lovely black eyed. Ma'iinun - water, spring.
It does not only mean eye, it can easily also mean "to eye something", i.e. that you are looking at something. Unfortunately we do not have the original Syriac Aramaic saying of Eysua, but we can use logical deduction based on reasonable assumptions and based on an analysis of how Semitic words are used in tradition we can with through logic deduct with relatively high precision what the original saying is supposed to say for real. I am used to these kinds of error while working on my Quran project and the probability is very high it is like I am saying here is making it pretty safe to say this is what Eysua actually was saying.
Jiim-Waw-Ba = Make a hole in a thing, rend or tear a thing, perforate/pierce/bore, to cut a thing, hollow a thing out, traverse or cross, cut through by journeying, penetrate, reply or answer or respond, illuminate and render clear, to shield.
Or:
Kh-Ra-Qaf = To pierce/bore/perforate, make a hole in something, to rend/slit/tear, feign or forge, be confounded or perplexed [so as to be unable to move], be ignorant of a thing, pass through/over/across, traverse, rough/ungentle/awkward/unskilled, unsound or deficient in intellect or understanding, to be liberal/bountiful/generous, be of generous disposition/largely beneficent, be denied gain of good or prosperity.
Miim-Zay-Qaf = To scatter or disperse, mangle/rent much/dissunder, shatter/disorganize/dissipate, to mar or impair, tear or cut much, to slit a thing.
Nun-Zay-Ayn = to draw forth, take away, pluck out, bring out, snatch away, remove, strip off, tear off, extract, withdraw, draw out sharply, perform ones duty, yearn, depose high officials, resemble, draw with vigour, invite others to truth, rise, ascend, draw from the abode or bottom, carry off forcibly, deprive.
There is a problem so many roots indicate towards tearing or tearing out, but the same words may mean to turn it away. Some definitions above sound exactly like in the saying, but it may also mean "Withdraw" or "take away".
Let us take a look at if you replace words for something else and see what happens to the sentence:
Is it saying:
29 If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one of your members than to have your whole body thrown into Gehenna.
30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one of your members than to have your whole body go into Gehenna.
Or is it saying:
29 If your outright eye looking causes you to sin, tear turn it out away and throw it away begone with it. It is better for you to lose one of your members/extremities than to have your whole body thrown into Gehenna [for it].
30 And if your outright hand deed/doing causes you to sin, cut it off from it and throw it away begone with it. It is better for you to lose one of your members/extremities than to have your whole body go into Gehenna [for it].
So read it like this and perhaps it sounds more reasonable:
27 "You have heard that it was said, 'You shall not commit adultery.'
28 But I say to you, everyone who looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
29 If your outright looking causes you to sin, turn it away and begone with it. It is better for you to lose one of your members/extremities than to have your whole body thrown into Gehenna [for it].
30 And if your outright deed/doing causes you to sin, cut off from it and begone with it. It is better for you to lose one of your members/extremities than to have your whole body go into Gehenna [for it]. 31 "It was also said, 'Whoever divorces his wife must give her a bill of divorce.'
32 But I say to you, whoever divorces his wife (unless the marriage is unlawful) causes her to commit adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
Also consider the context of what Eysua is talking about which is adultery and including even looking upon a woman with desire is considered committing adultery. It is pretty clear he is telling that if merely looking causes you to sin, so then focus on tearing yourself away from it, turning away from it and stopping it, begone with it. He is probably saying "if" as an example of when outright looking is causing sin, then one should not let oneself do it, so he is practically saying one should never even allow themselves to even look. He is speaking of the habit of turning your eyes towards the other sex and look, and so learn to always steer your eyes off the other sex. Same with if you are doing something, even if it is not literally touching the other sex but simply doing something with your body towards the person of the other sex (or same sex if you happen to be attracted to the same sex). Many people find it tempting to charm others on purpose just for the sake of doing it.
It is better to lose one of your little extremities (the vain habit of pleasure) than have to experience Jehennom because of it for the whole body. It is difficult to make out exactly how the original saying is to be without the Syriac Aramaic, but my hypothesis is he is saying that it is better to be rid of what causes you to sin, i.e. what your weakness in the world is, rather than having to reface Jehennom with the whole body/spectrum because of it. What that means is one little silly sin makes you have to reface Jehennom for the whole magnitude, when if you had dealt with your weakness would make you not have to experience Jehennom again. The reason why the language looks like this, i.e. Eysua does not speak of literally cutting off or tearing out, but it yet talks about facing Jehennom for it, is because the concept of reincarnation is true and whatever weaknesses you have here may cause you to have to face Jehennom for it, to the whole magnitude (for the whole body). Jehennom is a Semitic descriptive noun which is derived from the root Je-Nun-(Nun) and it means "the outer layer" or "the bodily", and the word Jehennom means "attachment to the bodily", it is a condition where you are forcibly subjected to being attached to one of these bodies on Earth. The ILM of Jehennom is [Outer Attachment Integrity Thereof], in ILM the word is quite forth-telling. A reason why unfortunate translations of Semitic scriptures say "have to face Jehennom forever" is because it is supposed to say "have to face the bodily attachment continually", the forever word is usually an exaggeration from a way that means something continuously, but it does not say it cannot end.
Eysua and the people around his era acknowledged reincarnation, but this concept was forgotten amidst Pagan clergymen who invented their own doctrines.
Be well Qarael Amenuel
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Post by Immanuel on Nov 11, 2017 18:39:16 GMT
A similar language as I mentioned previously here:
Matthew 18 8 If your hand or foot causes you to sin, cut it off/cut off from it and throw it away/begone with it. It is better for you to enter into life maimed or crippled than with two hands or two feet to be thrown into eternal fire.
9 And if your eye-ing/looking causes you to sin, tear it out/turn it away and throw it away/begone with it. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into fiery Gehenna.
It is harder to know what Eysua is saying about what is better. But he is probably saying it is better to handicap yourself by where you cannot go or cannot obtain, than to have them two hands and two feet face Jehennom. A reason it is so hard is because it is likely metaphorical, i.e. the doing you do with hands, feet or eyes. It is probably related to that you have to do things twice, it becomes double, but since there are also two hands or two feet or two eyes, the metaphor is perhaps easy to translate improperly and that the language is descriptive in origin.
Point is, logic tells Eysua is impossibly speaking of the literal hands, feet and eyes. It would be simply absurd.
So these phrases are a problem:
It is better for you to enter into life maimed or crippled than with two hands or two feet to be thrown into eternal fire.
It is better for you to enter into life with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into fiery Gehenna.
It is difficult to find a translation for them because we lack the original Syriac Aramaic utterance and it is hard to speculate. Still we can conclude Eysua is speaking of the full magnitude of Jehennom for the whole of your bodily experience on Earth. I would still say he is speaking of doing things in the world not to the full ability of the hands, feet and eyes, and so to say only life out life in half, and why maimed, or crippled, or living life with one eye, are used and it is metaphorical. Many things you do with the hands, feet and eyes are outright sins and it is better to do the handings, feeting and eyeing which is the better half. He is henceforth telling about the better half of the abilities of the hands, feet and eyes.
With experience from Arabic to English translation of Quran, I am quite certain that it is not supposed to be read "if" in front of the sentence but more like "the" and so it would be "The handing or footing of yours which causes you to sin..." or "the eyeing which causes you to sin..." Let me try to render the sentence once again:
8 The handing or footing of yours which causes you to sin, cut off from it and begone with it. It is better for you to be in life maimed or crippled than with two/both [ways of] handing or with two/both [ways of] footing, being thrown into eternal fire.
9 And the eye-ing of yours which causes you to sin, turn away from it and begone with it. It is better for you to be in life with one [way of] eyeing than with two/both [ways of] eyeing [which leads] to being thrown into fiery Gehenna.
This is the best hypothesis I can bring forth and it is by adding some logic and comparison with common translation problems I have seen with Arabic. Add this translation view to the previous post about not looking upon women or doing things with them, and you have good alternatives to what Eysua is really saying instead of some extremist cutting off of limbs or tearing out eyes, literally.
Be well Qarael Amenuel
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